Wednesday, December 23, 2009

Sudarshan Kriya: FREEING or FRYING the mind?

BY HUMBLE WITNESS

Blank. That is how I remember feeling after my first kriya--blank, unable to think, lightheaded, and numb/tingly all over. I admit, it was mildly pleasant. At that time, it did occur to me that breathing faster and deeper than my body required for an extended period of time might actually be harmful. But because of the teacher’s reassurance that these effects are normal, combined with the fact that others in the class shared the same experiences, I ignored my intuition and neglected to research the physiological effects of over-breathing. And coming from a scientific background, I am still miffed at myself for not having researched it back then, but according to the old adage, “its better late than never”…

After devoting years of my life to AoL, serving as a volunteer and teacher, and blindly propagating the myth that the kriya is beneficial and should be practiced daily, I now realize that I have made a tremendous error in judgment, and that sudarshan kriya (aka hyperventilation) is harmful. This is just one of the reasons why I chose to leave AoL and cease promoting its practices.

When students ask where the kriya came from, I tell them it was “cognized” by ssrs during a 10-day period of silence in the early 80’s. Looking back, it’s amazing to me how many people (including myself) blindly accepted the kriya as something holy and beneficial based on its source and the short-term pleasant feeling it evokes. But I am left wondering what are its long-term effects. When a drug is discovered, it goes through years of clinical trials before being prescribed. Even cosmetics need testing for harmful effects. Sure, the kriya is claimed to consist of “natural rhythms” of breathing and therefore cannot be harmful. I could argue that masturbation is also natural, but just because it feels good doesn’t mean that one should practice it every day. Practicing kriya for its short-term pleasant effect is no different than doing drugs.

Today, its common knowledge that hyperventilation (defined as simply breathing faster or deeper than necessary) can cause dizziness, lightheadedness, numbness in the limbs, and even fainting/loss of consciousness. The reason for these side effects is because by over-breathing, one is actually depriving oneself of oxygen-- hyperventilation excessively rids the body of carbon dioxide, low carbon dioxide causes blood vessels to constrict, and constricted vessels carry less blood and oxygen to the different parts of the body (including the brain.) This is a condition known as hypoxia, and cells starved of oxygen eventually die. So I cringe to think of how many brain cells I have fried after my many years of practicing kriya.

Advocates of the kriya might argue that it is “controlled hyperventilation” and therefore not harmful. They might even refer you to the “scientific research” on the kriya that supports its many benefits. Hyperventilation is hyperventilation (no matter how you spin it), and I have gone through a number of the articles on the kriya, most (if not all) of which were published by devotees of ssrs. Most of them (particularly the earlier ones) are lacking in the proper controls, and it is unclear whether subjects are doing the full sk with associated pranayams, or sk alone. I have yet to see a truly unbiased, well-controlled study with convincing data supporting the unsubstantiated claims that sk is the cure-all it is touted to be.

I also have my own experience to back up my conclusion that sk is downright harmful. During my involvement with the organization, I have witnessed many suffer from mental imbalance and detrimental effects after practicing kriya. I have known two people who had to stop doing kriya because it induced panic attacks in them. I have witnessed one pour soul lose mental stability and have to be committed due to manic episodes and delusions of grandeur. And I have seen three well-adjusted, well-educated individuals with a promising future and a passion for their career only to abruptly decide to throw away their education to do full-time “seva” for AoL. As for me, I can remember how I used to be before ever practicing kriya—much more sharp, and quick to respond and recall words and names. I feel my intellect has dulled since then. And after reading Klim’s posts, I realize I am not alone.

I can’t claim to know what is good for everyone else, but I can draw from my own faculties and experiences to decide what is right for me. I whole-heartedly encourage everyone else to do the same.

32 comments:

Jivani said...

Okay, this is a little disturbing. Frying the mind is pretty serious. I have not tried the Sudarshan Kriya because I found this blog before becoming involved with AoL. The person who recommended I take the course also gets terrible headaches from practicing sudarshan kriya.

ritha said...

i practice guided meditation thats safer and do one long kriya a week sky isnt for everyone and definitely not for me....on a regular basis i practice more traditional forms of yoga once i realised that sky only once a week suits me..but jivani doing the course i actually felt relaxed so i did it as it was reccomeded by my doctor but i dont like aol at all......

Anonymous said...

Not just this hyperventilation. Enforced limited hours of sleep also damage brain cells.

The imperious , illinformed hindu lobby wants to make yoga compulsory for schoolchildren.Already lots of children have been coerced into doing skriya. Every issue will be given a religious colour by fanatical Indians.

Now language chauvinism in the form of compulsory hindi imposition for all is brewing.Unlike the West , there is no sane institution or competent body for redressal.

Can't we see for ourselves?

Anonymous said...

"Terrible headaches from SK".

Ask the teacher, and he/she will reply - his negative energy /negative emotions are removed from head which are stored for years (or may be from last few births) Headache is good sign.
God bless SSRS.

John M. Knapp, LMSW said...

"Headache is good sign"?

Just like Ravi's master, the Maharishi, taught. No matter what painful side effect reported to him by his students, the Maharishi's bland reply was "Something good is happening."

I can see how interpreting anything painful as a "good sign" works for Ravi: Since there is no rational way to judge whether SK helped or hurt its practitioners, Ravi's message goes unchallenged: "Get me more members -- especially rich, beautiful, influential ones! Bring me more money! World peace is assured! Get me the Nobel Peace Prize! Me! Me! Me!"

And, hey, if SK is causing you pain, there must be something wrong with YOU: You're doing it wrong! You don't have enough faith in me! You must have bad karma! It's all just another "good sign"!

Nice gig.

J.

Anonymous said...

I took the basic course at an AOL ashram in Germany a few years ago. The teacher was a friendly young man named Christoph, who seemed sincere but I was amazed at how naive and uneducated he was about breathing practices. First of all, hyperventilating doesn't increase usable oxygen in the cells. Through excessive release of crabon dioxide, hyperventilating leads to oxygen deficiency, the oxygen sticks to the red blood cells and the cells actually needing oxygen go into hyopcapnia. This is well known and the reason why you try to calm down hyperventilation in divers or in people with shock. Second, the nice buzz or lightheadedness after hyperventilation is mostly caused by endorphins released as a response to this oxygen deficiency and no different from the runner's high or other form of stress - related endorphin release. There is nothing particularly healing, physically or emotionally, about such an endorphin release. Spontaneous hyperventilating can sometimes occur during emotional healing, but educated breathing therapists, such as those trained in Reichian breath work, know when to induce this in clients, always with supervision. To turn hyperventilating into a panacea, as if it somehow cleanses the emotions or energy system, is naive to say the least. Breathing practices in spiritual systems also require specific knowledge about what an individual person needs at different times. I have seen Taoist teachers sometimes letting 20 people practice 20 different techniques in one class, because of their ability to read a person's constitution. Advanced yoga practices also tend to be customized to some extend for specific people. When I attended a yoga class many years ago, the teacher taught fire breath (almost identical to sudarsha kriya) but recommended to me to stay away from it because of my firey consitution. Franchising practices and making making one technique into a panacea is out of touch with life. It is also devoid of real compassion, because compassion must be rooted in a deep acceptance of human nature, which means there are no overly simplistic solutions to all problems. When a spiritual technique is sold as a universal solution to all problems, most people will fail to get to the promised results and then they are shamed/made wrong for not delivering. A non - cultish spiritual movement will place people and their growth first,which may mean acknowledging that the movement doesn't always have the best support for everybody.

Liz said...

Hi John ,

I briefly glanced through your profile to know more about you. What is your opinion on yoga, chanting and meditation techniques ? Is there are benefit from these or are they just waste of money ?

Being senior TM teacher, could you give your opinion on the health side effects of SK ?

From these blogs, it seems like most of these eastern new age religious traditions are one form of quackery or other.

John Christian said...

The first time i did the Kriya i experienced a level of love that i have not experienced since. Deep, pervading and unconditional. It lasted quite a while. But it was equisite and beautiful.

John M. Knapp, LMSW said...

Hi, Liz,

Thanks for checking my bio out! If you ever have questions for me, you're welcome to ask me on this wonderful blog or email me directly at jmknapp53@gmail.com.

I think yoga, meditation, and chanting are great. I myself practice meditation daily -- and I know I should do more yoga! As you might imagine, I don't do TM anymore -- not because it's not about as good as any other beginning meditation technique, but rather because of the emotional baggage it has for me.

The only caution I offer to anyone asking about meditation techniques is to practice them in moderation. Many, many of my clients who have serious physical or emotional problems practiced long hours of meditation for months or years. (For those who don't know about these groups, we used to meditate up to 8 hours a day or more when we did what we called "rounding." And allegedly the Maharishi, before he died, set up some "boys" to do "dark rounding" in caves in the Himalayas around the clock until they became enlightened. I'm told they are still there!)

As to SK, I've never experienced it myself. The closest we came in TM was "rapid pranayam" -- which was alternate nostril breathing as fast as we could do it -- from about 15 seconds to a minute or more, depending on rounding experience and position in the TM hierarchy. I used to get some of the effects people talk about here for brief periods of time: dizziness, energy rushes, shaking, "lobster hands" (hands forming into claws), a mental high, occasionally headaches, and others.

The thing is pretty much anyone I've known who did some sort of hyperventilation had pretty much the same "symptoms."

And extended hyperventilation has numerous side-effects, some of which are dangerous. This isn't the best article on the long-term effects of hyperventilation, but it may give you some ideas.

If anyone is interested I can try to dig up some more formal information on the effects of hyperventilation.

But the bottom line for me is that those clients of mine who have reported using hyperventilation techniques tell me that they are concerned that some side-effects, such as problems with concentration and memory, are quasi-permanent. They seem to fade for most people if they stop the practice.

I want to be clear: Not everyone who practices these techniques reports problems -- in fact, most don't seem to. But a good number of people I've talked with do. Whether they learned them in AoL, other Eastern groups, or even good-old American LifeSpring, back in the 90s.

Hope that helped!

J.

Anonymous said...

Being an ex-aol teacher myself, I read this blog and recognize so much of my own story -and that of several friends, also ex-teachers. Thank you Klim for sharing, you make a difference to all the people damaged by aol, who need reassurance that life offers alternative paths.
Regarding Kriya, I had the same experience as John Christian:
"The first time i did the Kriya i experienced a level of love that i have not experienced since. Deep, pervading and unconditional. It lasted quite a while. But it was equisite and beautiful."
In later years, the long Kriya stopped having any effect for me, it was mostly boring to do.
My point: Yes, in many ways you can compare Kriya to drugs. As with many drugs, it has recreational value, possible therapeutical value, and it carries the risk of becoming addictive, leading you to drug abuse.
Regardless of wether you compare Kriya to a modern designer drug (Ecstasy used to be called "empathy", and some marriage counsillors would administer small doses to their clients before therapy, to induce love and understanding between their clients), or more traditional drugs like cannabis or alcohol (anthropologists will tell you how almost all cultures at all times contain recreational or ritualistic use of drugs), the fact remains: A drug is just a drug. Blame the pusher, selling it to innocent young minds, without telling them of side-effects or the risk of addiction.
My days of drug-pushing are over, and after ridding myself of my addiction to practice, I find I can again enjoy more conventional drugs on a recreational basis.
By the way, if you want a fantastic read on cults and the mechanisms of guru/disciple relationships, read:
http://www.amazon.com/Guru-Papers-Masks-Authoritarian-Power/dp/1883319005

Jivani said...

Some of the things i hear about SK reminds me of a drug high. I question it's lasting effect. If I have a few glasses of wine, I feel really good. But the next day I usually feel sick. The high just doesn't last.

When I first started to meditate I felt good. But it wasn't like a massive high where I was on top of the world. After about 3 years of daily practice, I started noticing subtle differences. One day I realized I was a happier person. But it wasn't a complete blast of love and euphoria (though I do have moments of that). It had a more subtle and lasting quality to it. I realized my practice was working. That feeling of deeper happiness has not gone away.

I guess the more I practice, the more I question practices that make me completely high and on top of the world instantly. Though I'm always happy to hear about a technique that eases depression or helps someone feel happy.

Many people have said that about SK. Since I haven't tried SK yet, I'm not saying it is like a drug and not a valid practice but I most certainly question it. I questioned it even before I read this blog because I got the feeling from readings about it that some consider it to be a miracle cure.

Liz said...

Hi John,

Thank you .

Liz

Gopal Krishna said...

Klim,

Do you not think that all pranayama techniques, if done in the wrong manner or excessively, can cause problems? All traditional yoga texts mention this. Anything done excessively is a problem.

Its true that pranayama increases the oxygen amount in the body (and brain) - but, let us accept that nature has not created humans perfectly. Many parts of our brain do not get prana and are inactive. Pranayama tries to awaken these inactive areas by making prana reach there.

Also, vigorous techniques like Bhastrika, Kapalbhati and SK are not supposed to be done when one's lungs and hearts do not have some level of health.

Actually, I do not practise SK, but I do practise a version of Kapalbhati (let us call it breath-kapalbhati to differentiate it from the popular version where one pulls in stomach during exhalation) where one exhales continuously as fast and as long as possible with entire focus on breath (and not trying to pull in stomach etc during the practice). And 5 rounds of this before thoughtless awareness techniques help in an amazing manner. Even during thoughtless awareness practice, when mind or body starts getting restless, I practise 5-rounds (with normal breathing for sometime in-between two consecutive rounds) of this breath-kapalbhati and restlessness go away. The only difference between this and SK is - former involves only exhalation whereas SK involves both inhalation and exhalation.

Is it possible that you felt ill-effects of S.K. because you did not practise it in moderation (like one should do with all vigorous pranayama techniques) or you expected it to help you beyond a measure, which, of course, no technique can do. If we want to do well in worldly life (academics, career, etc), yoga can be only an aid but no substitute for planning and hard work.

Please consider my points with an open mind. I will also be interested to learn whether you feel breath-kapalbhati can also have some ill-effects in long run on its practitioners based on whatever logic you find for SK's potential harmful effects in the long run.

Regards,

Gopal

Peaceful Warrior said...

Yoga techniques are said have come from masters who would do them spontaneously in samadhi. The techniques were later formalized. I think that's how kriya came about too. RS may have just spontaneously started breathing in soham...and seen some good effects in himself. Later the technique was refined (by trying the mantra on human guinea pigs), and lo and behold Sudarshan Kriya was born.

It is not bad technique, especially for beginners. But willful techniques have a beginning and an end. At some point you have to drop techniques and just be natural.

Art of Leaving said...

Peaceful Warrior: “It is not bad technique, especially for beginners.”

Reactions to Sudarshan Kriya may vary, but in some instances it is definitely a bad technique, and especially so for beginners. In mid-2006 someone mentioned to my Iyengar Yoga teacher how AoL people had gone teaching South African prisoners AoL pranayama techniques, and how some of these prisoners completely lost it, went mad. She was angry and disgusted at how irresponsible the AoL people were to teach non-Yoga practitioners these techniques.

As for myself, initially I liked the hyperventilating effects of SK – tingling energy sensations, hands and fingers going into a kind of spasm, etc. I thought it meant some energy blockages were being cleared. The harmful effect of it all, though, was to create an intense feeling of imminent physical and psychological release, but without ever actually reaching that promised point of release. As a result, all my physical and mental tensions merely increased, and I developed a strong desire to do more kriyas in an attempt to gain that release.

When I became unable to cope with all my emotional turmoil in relation to RS, I ended up doing 3 kriyas a day. Every kriya was followed by another hour or two of spontaneous breathing processes in an attempt to gain the release that kriya always promised, but never delivered. My body spontaneously continued some of the kriya rhythms, interspersed with long retentions of inhalations and explosive releases, as well as long suspensions of breath after exhalations, and also lots of abdominal contractions and releases.

Of course, the end result of it all was that all the nerves became raw – physically and emotionally. I felt completely shredded inside, like an insubstantial ghost. It’s now three years later and healing is still not complete.

Art of Leaving said...

Gopal Krishna: “Is it possible that ... you expected it to help you beyond a measure, which, of course, no technique can do.”

The point is that huge expectations are deliberately created around Sudarshan Kriya. Ravi once said that doing SK even just once in a year has its effect.

In my Basic/Part I Course we were told that an AoL teacher was sent by Ravi to teach the AoL techniques to the Yogis in the Himalayas. According to the story, the teacher hesitated, telling Ravi that he didn’t feel up to teaching Yogis. Ravi reportedly said to him that the Yogis will listen to him because He (Ravi) is sending him. The teacher then went forth on the mission, first teaching them the 3-stage pranayama and bhastrika. The Yogis were said to have pulled up their noses at these two techniques, telling the AoL teacher that they know hundreds of variations of those. But when taught Sudarshan Kriya, lo and behold, the Himalayan Yogis were dumbstruck and filled with such gratitude, saying that never in their lives have they ever experienced such great peace.

Of course, where exactly this took place and how many “Yogis” were present, were not stated. The story made it sound as if the whole Himalayas had been summoned.

P Naik said...

All these Eastern meditations and techniques came from Yogis and Adepts who practised rigorous and unselfish processes, using a great degree of analysis and introspection. They had no desires to build large organizations, ashrams, Multi-level Marketing schemes, hierarchies, accountants, marketing executives, etc. These modern "gurus" like Sri Sri are just clever businessmen, who are hustling and peddling a few techniques so that they can amass a following and wealth.

P Naik said...

Hey Sri Sri, if you really want to help humanity (and not just the paying kind), think of spreading your art of living movement to the poorest of the poor living around the world. They sure could use some stress-relief! Oh! I forgot that may bankrupt you and close the place.

The Reformer said...

Hey KLIM, its me Anon from http://artoflivingfree.blogspot.com/2010/01/walk-like-king-and-be-perfect-doormat.html?showComment=1272399715207#c19081312164380208 I'll call myself "The Reformer" :P

I was reading about hyperventilation. Take a look at the wiki entry. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyperventilation It says "Hyperventilation can also be brought about voluntarily, by taking many deep breaths in rapid succession." I don't think Sudarshan Kriya fits exactly in this category, because the deepest breaths are well spaced, the mediums are moderately spaced and the short ones are rapid. And if SK must fit in this, then I guess many of the ancient pranayama techniques would also fall in this category. And to prove that they are all hyperventilation... Well I wouldn't attempt that exhausting a task.

There maybe people, whose health may respond adversely to SK. But then again, SK should should NOT be taken as a medical therapy and a replacement for medication, even though large number of people report positive health effects. And in case of existing medical conditions, a qualified physician should be consulted before attempting it. This applies to all forms of pranayama and yoga techniques, not just SK.

I'm neither supporting nor going against SK. What I'm saying is that, it would be unjust to term SK as outright hyperventilation, based on some experiences. At the same time, it wouldn't be fair not to say so either. Thus, proper discretion should be used before choosing SK, based on each individual's health condition.

And one more little thing I noticed... a large number of participants, do not follow one particular instruction given in the class i.e to drink lots of water. The reason given for this is of course, "a large amount of toxins are released and they need to be flushed out". I can't really say, how authentic that statement is. But drinking lots (not excess) of water is, proven to be a good practice.

Now coming back to the scientific aspect... Hyperventilation results in exhaling carbon dioxide (CO2) at a higher rate than at which it is being generated. This results in lower levels of CO2 in the blood. And since CO2 is transported as carbonic acid (H2CO3), the acidity of blood goes down, or conversely the alkalinity of blood goes up. This rise in alkalinity is what cause vasoconstriction i.e constriction of blood vessels which supply the brain with oxygen, leading to lack of oxygen.

Now, while pure water is neutral, regular drinking water could be either slightly acidic or slightly alkaline. In either case, it is less alkaline than the now "more alkaline" blood stream. My theory is, by drinking a lot of water, which is absorbed into the blood stream "dilutes" it. In other words the rise in alkalinity would be offset. Of course, I'm not a chemist and haven't done research with the numbers.

Another point is that, prior to SK, we do certain pranayama. This I feel increases the oxygen levels in the blood stream, high enough to offset the reduced supply to the brain due to vasoconstriction. This is of course just a guess.

What I'm trying to say is that, there is some other phenomenon or reaction that is happening in the system during SK, than just hyperventilation. That something is able to bring out all the positive effects that we see around us. I'm unable to fathom a guess as to what it is. Doctors may know better.

In conclusion if attempted with discretion, along with careful observation of instructions, SK ideally should not be a cause of such panic.

Hari said...

@Reformer : Well written.
Scientific and makes sense too.

Svetana said...

@ Hari, who said:
@Reformer : Well written.
Scientific and makes sense too.

Hari, what is your education? I am asking you, because stuff written by Reformer is neither scientific, nor makes sense. The fact that he uses scientific words doesn’t make his opinion scientific. It is really only his opinion. He is just guessing. That’s his right, but don’t call it science.

Here are some quotes from Reformer’s message, confirming that he is in the “guess world”:

“The reason given for this is of course, "a large amount of toxins are released and they need to be flushed out". I can't really say, how authentic that statement is.”

“My theory is, by drinking a lot of water, which is absorbed into the blood stream "dilutes" it. In other words the rise in alkalinity would be offset. Of course, I'm not a chemist and haven't done research with the numbers.”

“Another point is that, prior to SK, we do certain pranayama. This I feel increases the oxygen levels in the blood stream, high enough to offset the reduced supply to the brain due to vasoconstriction. This is of course just a guess.”

“What I'm trying to say is that, there is some other phenomenon or reaction that is happening in the system during SK, than just hyperventilation. That something is able to bring out all the positive effects that we see around us. I'm unable to fathom a guess as to what it is. Doctors may know better. “

I would like to see a doctor, who would suggest doing hyperventilation to gain positive health effects. May be only in some rare cases?
It’s really curious what “all the positive effects that we see around us” are? I was with AOL ‘breathing community” for several years and talked to a lot of people. Nobody reported any magic positive effects of SK. People have the same old health problems, some have serious new problems, some died.

The Reformer said...

@Hari

Svetana is right you know :)

@Svetana

A scientist from a jet propulsion lab will probably know close to zero about growing plants in sand and artificial light! LOL. Yes you're right. I'm not denying that I am in the "guess world". :) Honestly I do not know what is happening exactly, and since I'm neither a doctor (biological knowledge) nor a chemist (knowledge of chemical reactions) I'm not in a position to say for sure. I'm only hoping that, someone like that would come across discussions such as these and who knows? My "wild guesses" could trigger some scientifically valid reasoning. After all you can't deny right way that I'm guessing is impossible. :)

And regarding knowing people who've had no good experiences, just bad experiences, more problems and died... This cannot be generalized to everybody. I agree, you might have met a lot of people with bad experiences. For that matter, I've met people who've been able to keep several ailments under check (I'm an example myself). Some people who completely got rid of ailments. And of course some who've had problems too. But I'm not saying "everybody" has had "magical" experiences.

People overrate this "magical" aspect. What is magical? Something that one is unable to explain rationally out of his/her own knowledge. For a little child, everything is magical. Anything is magical, until it is explained by science. Do not brand anything as good or bad right away. I won't. After all, we can't have met "everybody". Our experiences are so limited. So have an open mind and wait for someone to do some serious research on the subject.

Antibiotics are used to treat so many illnesses, but they can also be really bad. Read http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antibiotic I'm not comparing breathing to antibiotics. :P While there is hyperventilation, there is also something called "controlled" hyperventilation, which many conveniently ignore. Just google for it and see how much research is being done on it.

I already mentioned, how hyperventilation is defined and why SK cannot be called hyperventilation. I would rather put it under controlled hyperventilation. Of course this is based on the definition in wikipedia and my experience of SK. :)

So to everyone reading this, do not judge right away. Our experiences and what we see are very limited. Do not attack SK. Do not embrace SK either. Wait for more research to be done and see what it is. Further reading here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neuropeptide

Cheers :)

Anonymous said...

"When I became unable to cope with all my emotional turmoil in relation to RS, I ended up doing 3 kriyas a day."

You're not supposed to do more than one kriya per day. Doing three like this is not following your guru's instructions. No wonder you had "raw nerves"! Meditation is also good for you, but try meditating 6 or 9 hours a day and you will go a little nuts! Follow the instructions of your spiritual teacher. This freelance stuff will make you crazy!

Wishnu101 said...

AOL harrasing the practioners:
--------------------------
Attended the AOL breathing training.Ravi Patak was the teacher that time.He said we have to follow
Ahimsa methods.He was sitting on a Silk saree.Asked him "you are sitting on killing of thosands of silkworms".He was taken back.Another point he told we have do randam act of Kindness by donating to starnger.For a joke told so acn you donate your house.He got wild to said if you ask any more question I will show the door.Said paid money for the course.That silent him.He is ateacher.He cant practice what he teach what kind of teaching is this.
Sudharshana Krya sounds like Viagra on breath.It rythums like sex act and sound also.Got headache after that.
Ver discriminative ways he is doing this.

Svetana said...

@Reformer, who said:

“And regarding knowing people who've had no good experiences, just bad experiences, more problems and died... This cannot be generalized to everybody. I agree, you might have met a lot of people with bad experiences. For that matter, I've met people who've been able to keep several ailments under check (I'm an example myself). Some people who completely got rid of ailments. And of course some who've had problems too. But I'm not saying "everybody" has had "magical" experiences.”

I am glad we are arriving at some agreement. You met SK practitioners, who were able to keep several ailments under check and people who completely got rid of ailments and, also, people who’ve had bad problems. I met people who felt relaxation with SK, but I have never met anybody, who was cured as a result of this practice. Some people reported that they developed some serious new health problems, some died. There is plenty of evidence about negative effects of SK on your health on this blog as well.

Anyway, all things mentioned above “cannot be generalized to everybody”, and there is no real scientific evidence or research that SK is good or bad for you. So, if you wish, do it AT YOUR OWN RISK. At least, if some good or bad thing happens to your health or you die, you will know that it was your own choice.

The Reformer said...

@Svetana

Of course it is my own choice my dear. That is what I've said in my earlier post.

"Thus, proper discretion should be used before choosing SK, based on each individual's health condition." I hope you didn't think I said that without understanding what it meant. LOL!

Personally, everyone in my family practices SK and our doctor has observed no abnormalities in our health. In fact the observations were that, I was far more healthy than I was before and the others are keeping surprisingly good health for their age. Now please don't question the doctor's credibility. Ihave no way of proving that to you! Hahaha

The highlighted "AT YOUR OWN RISK" really made me laugh. Thanks for the warning though. I've seen both sides. I'm really sorry that you've been exposed only to the problems created and not the good aspects. Maybe you'll get to see the good side too. I know you wouldn't want me to count on that. But hey, it is nice to see something good too. :)

Cheers. I really enjoyed reading your reply. :)

Wishnu101 said...

Increasing serotinin has to be balanced with other neurotransmitter.Incrasing only one neuro Trans has to scientifically to be tested for the effects of balance.
It is like if you eat too much sugar.and its effect

Svetana said...

@Reformer

SK positive/negative health effects is not about my personal experience, or your personal experience with this practice, or good health of your family members.
Once there are people, who developed health problems with SK, then, practitioners should be informed about possible complications and do it AT THEIR OWN RISK, if they wish. It's fair to do so, if you care about people, isn't it?

The Reformer said...

@Svetana

Phew I'm getting a bit tired of this. I am NOT at loggerheads with you Svetana. LOL!! Again I repeat,

"Thus, proper discretion should be used before choosing SK, based on each individual's health condition."

That inherently means "AT YOUR OWN RISK".

I mentioned the health condition of me and my family because you said,

"At least, if some good or bad thing happens to your health or you die, you will know that it was your own choice."

The "you" in that statement can be taken as both Svetana talking about the people in general and Svetana talking about Reformer. While I can't comment about general health with authority, I can, about my health.

In conclusion, people should be advised to consult a doctor before practicing any form of yoga, let alone SK. My only request is, no one should be biased. It is not fair to inform people only of the negative effects, based on limited experiences, "If you do SK you will get problems or even die". They should be told about both the positive AND negative effects.

Lots of Love.

Svetana said...

@ Reformer

"We are reformers in Spring and Summer; in Autumn and Winter we stand by the old; reformers in the morning, conservers at night."
- Ralph Waldo Emerson

Just kidding.
With best wishes.

Chander Kant KUK said...

I was Suffering from Insomnia and by Sudarshak Kriya. I got Dipression also and Loss of mental State which I improve in very Difficult way by doing Anulom-Vilom and other Pranayam. Sudarshan Kriya is Like a Kriya-Karam of a Person. A Person mind can upset anytime and may not recover....Dr. Chander Kant, Professor, K.U. Kurukshetra

Anonymous said...

I had done AOL course in 2007 and I feel very happy at that time , But when I keep doing the SK & P regularly I feel that my energy was shattered and I am feeling very week physically ,I am having dark circles around my eyes . I know that it is only because of SK&P so I decided not to do it , after one week of time I again gained my energy back and dark circles were gone.

My wife had done the same in 2007 and she was find it to be very good her depression gone stabilized her mind gaining energy and she feels to be very happy .
Again we both done same course but this time I feel myself to be reverse , gaining energy balance of mind happy feeling , but my wife gone through bad effects she feels uneasyness and she feels darkness in her sight and same day I used to take her to the doctor .now she is feeling alright with the help of the medicines .
I think SK&P will provide you instant short term benefits . and it changed person to person and time to time . what exactly I don't know but one of my friend also feel the same.

Moreover if you find any member in AOL who is poor and needy then plaese let me know, all rich , influential,beautiful people are there.
why it is like that poor people are not human beings, can AOL conduct a course free of cost for the poor people .

They conduct the courses in jails and with the terrorist, naxalites for their own publicity ,of course free of cost .
And they ask you to bring more members who are like you, powerful, rich, influential and celebrities .